Hey all, I'm sure everyone's tired of this sort of post, but I think my beer is infected and I'd really love a little expert advice. I've been brewing for a few years now (>10...) but I've never seen anything like this before. Now I've never had any contamination before either - I try to be as sanitary as possible (though I'm certainly not fanatical about it) and I've always just chalked it up to good luck, but maybe my luck has tripped up on me a bit this batch. Anyway, the beer is a pseudo-lager - my first try with lager yeast - OG around 1.035 (low by design..) Pretty basic recipe - something like 3.3lbs light malt extract, 1 lb rice syrup, 0.5 lbs crystal and 1 lb carapils steeped at ~155 for ~30 mins - hour boil w/ 1 oz northern brewer and 0.5 oz tettnanger at the last 5 min. Pitched w/ wyeast 2112... No problem. Primary went great for a week at ~70F (I know a little high, but I figure it might be a little fruity which will be just fine for my first stab at a lager style) racked to a glass carboy, secondary went fine for a couple of days, and then I saw this:

http://picasaweb.google.com/dnr101/629?authkey=Gv1sRgCJfD4aTwtMPL5gE&feat=directlink

It started out as little floating bits on top, probably just yeast, but then the bubbles - they freak me out a bit. I popped the airlock off really quick and gave it a little sniff and it seems maybe a little off, but I can't be positive about that either. Help! I'd be really bummed if it's a gonner, but I guess they say it happens to everyone sometime!

Thanks a bunch,
-Dave

I don't get it. More than 10 years experience and you're fermenting a lager at 70* for a yeast that is 58-68*? Why would you want a fruity lager? Lagers, by style are supposed to be free of any of those yeasty-produced flavors. And 10+ years with no infection? You must not be brewing enough.

ANyway, I can't load your pictures, but it sounds like just CO2 bubbles on top. Nothing you can do now anyway, so sit tight, take a gravity ready when you think it should be done, and taste your sample. If it sucks, there's your answer. 5 gallons of ruined wort in 10+ years is pretty damn good. If it's ok, drink up.

What do you mean by smells a little off? Anything in particular? The picture is useful, but a smell or flavor would help even more.

Mike - I'm sure I'm not brewing enough, but we all do the best we can, no? And yes - I am brewing ~2 degrees F above the specified range of the yeast, but lacking refrigeration equipment and after consideration of the California common style I decided to give it a whirl and see what happens. I've kept it in a water bath and I've been dumping ice on it about as fast as my ice maker makes it, but still hovering around 70 is the best I can do in the summer. Anyway, I'm not trying to win any awards here, just experiment...

Dick - I just went over and took two big snout fulls and I think it honestly smells ok - am I just being paranoid? I've truly never seen weird bubbles like that before...

Thanks for looking guys, I appreciate the help, as I'm in an area without a lot of home brewers around and I don't have anyone else to ask. The nearest shops are at least 2 hours away (Baltimore...)

-Dave

Dave,

You may have stirred up some yeast that had settled when you transferred your batch to secondary. I had a similar phenomenon happen when I transferred by batch to secondary and added some dry hops. Within a few days, I had some white cloud-like floating debris in the top of my carboy. Turns out it was just some yeast that got re-invigorated. If I were you, pull off a sample with a thief and taste it. If it is bacteria, it will taste bad. My two cents.

Pete

I agree sample it and if it tastes medicine like or just really bad toss it. But if the smell test seems ok now, I'd say finish it out and try it completed. I find I don't care for some of my beer at various stages but the finished product usually brings a smile to my face...

Make sure you give us some follow-up regarding this batch. It will help with the grand collective knowledge base of beer!!!!

Pete

i think it looks fine from those pics. Looks like yeast and bubbles. To get the temp down fill about half way with water and some frozen soda bottles. You should be able to get around 50 to 60 degrees at least doing this.

Thanks all - I'm going to grab a sample and taste it tonight and I'll let everyone know how it's doing. Paul - I'll try that soda bottle trick for the temp - I'll have to find some soda bottles though...

-Dave

It looks like brettanomyces.

http://www.ithacabeer.com/beerblog/index.php

Yeah, it does kinda....

if thats what Brett looks like then my lambic is looking great after 4 weeks.

That was my impression after looking at the pictures. Never seen just Sacc do that in secondary.

Ship it to N8, I think he loves the brett stuff

Well, I drew off a little sample just now and gave it a thorough smell/ taste and I have to say I think, as of right now, it's fine. If it is a wild yeast infection, (Which - wouldn't that be really weird considering the amount of sugar left by the time it gets to the secondary and the amount of Sacc that's already established in there...) then would that mean that instead of a pseudo-lager I'm now making a pseudo-gueuze? I guess at this point I'll give it another 2-3 weeks in the secondary and bottle it and see what happens. I'll be sure to post back here with the results, in the interest of science of course!
Thanks again to all for the help and advice, it is appreciated.
-Dave

If it is brett, you may not notice much of a flavor difference for a while.

Brett beers usually take a while to start tasting sour.

If I bottle after say 4 weeks (not much time to get sour...) would the brett contribute a lot in the bottle, say like some stronger beers develop with age? Most of the improvement with age I've seen in the past is more of a mellowing and intermingling of flavors..
Thanks,
-D

Yes, it will continue to develop in the bottle.

Pardon the ignorance, but I'm confused as to where the Brett came in? Dave, have you brewed with Brett recently? I've never used it, but I know that if you use it and don't clean your equipment properly it can hang around and be a nuisance. Is it possible for it to appear out of nowhere? Just trying to gain some clarity for future reference.

well its not going to just appear and it might not even be brett. But you can get an infection from just about anywhere. There are billions of bacteria and whatnot in the air everyday.

I love brett so maybe it will turn out better then you thought.

No, I've never used it. I'm thinking it's ambient wild yeast at worst and just my 2112 looking a little strange at best. Either way, it's getting bottled at the end of the month and we'll find out if it's any good a coupe of weeks later... For what it's worth, the weird bubbles haven't gotten any worse, and might have even gone away some. I've never used lager yeast before, maybe it just looks a little different than i'm used to.
-D